What happened to good manners? by raistlin (Page 1 of 2)


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raistlin
I really do think that the informality and immediacy of the internet has, at least in part, caused the downfall of basic good manners.

I was having a good rummage around earlier today on a forum I only occasionally visit and was disgusted with the number of questions, demands for information, demands for assistance etc. which all shared the commonality of not having the word PLEASE anywhere in the posts.

When I were a lad, if the word was absent when I asked either of my parents for something, I was simply ignored. It didn't take long for me to realise my error but invariably, an apology was required before I made progress by using the magic word.

Needless to say, I don't react to any of that sort of post. Unfortunately, a lot of people do, thereby perpetuating the assumption that it is acceptable to demand rather than ask.

I wonder whether the phrase THANK YOU ever crosses the minds of the demanding.
Paul

Cogito ergo sum... maybe?

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Posted 20 Dec 2012, 19:03 #1 

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Jürgen
Sounds familiar ...
Recently I've got a PM on another forum. No hello, no please and no complimentary close at all, just a demand for information. The only appropriate answer has been to click on the delete button.
Jürgen

75ZT Community & Midlands Nano Meets & 75 & ZT Enthusiasts

Posted 20 Dec 2012, 20:54 #2 

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Bermudan 75
The written English language contains numerous 'rules of grammer'. These 'rules' wre used to convey in written form the nuances of the spoken word. For example the last word before a comma is spoken in a higher tone than the preceeding words, the last word is then spoken in a lower tone than the preceeding words.

The Internet spurns such rules and debases the English language (another thank you to the USA) and has also resulted in a world where manners are disappearing underneath a sea of 'text speak'.

Thank you for reading this post.
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Posted 21 Dec 2012, 19:00 #3 

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Borg Warner
I think Paul you and I were brought up and not "drug up"! Being polite was part of our education, both at school and at home. It costs nothing and the rewards can be quite dramatic. Had to go the the doctors today for removal of dressing and stitch, as I came out I was unable to open one of the doors, still on two walking sticks and San was going to bring the car closer, lady by the door asked if I was going that way and promptly opened the door for me. "Thank you" I said, "You're welcome" was the reply and with a smile.

Posted 21 Dec 2012, 19:40 #4 


carlpenn
I think I may be guilty of this crime myself. If so, I do apologise and would take the opportunity to say that I always appreciate any help for questions I have posted, I do know I always say "thanks" or "Cheers", but I may have omitted the 'Please'.

I shall now hang my head in shame.

I feel very embaressed. :(
Upgrades:

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Posted 21 Dec 2012, 21:21 #5 

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raistlin
I have just re-read 'Talk to the Hand' by Lynne Truss again and it all becomes perfectly clear now :lol:

If you care about good manners and you haven't read this book, might I suggest that it'll be a worthwhile investment in time :)
Paul

Cogito ergo sum... maybe?

Click the image to go to Nano-Meet Website
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Posted 22 Dec 2012, 12:18 #6 

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zojosc
Good manners I believe are installed when we are very young and therefore become a habit. We only ape what we see or hear, hence the regional dialect. Pump American tv, and loutish behaviour in to a child at an early age and this is what they think is the norm.
Thankfully at my age(60)my father seemed to come from a differant age and was strict on behaviour, manners and dress code. I hated it at the time but now I believe I have the etiquette to socialise "correctly" when the need be but I can mix it with the lads on the building site when I feel it appropriate.
"Keep Smilin'"
Andy

Posted 22 Dec 2012, 13:00 #7 

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Bermudan 75
:iagree:
I think manners, consideration and courtesy are declining in a world of 'me, me, I want, I want'. Sadly I see many examples where I live. I was recently in a pub, yes, very unusual for me, watching with some other people, the football on the TV. A young woman (aged 25-30) came in with her young children and stood in front of the TV. Her attitude was that we would have to move to continue watching the TV. She was obviously well educated but patently lacking in manners. What chance do her children have of growing up with manners I wonder?.
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Posted 02 Mar 2013, 20:50 #8 

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Duncan
It wasn't the Cat perhaps was it?
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Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:18 #9 

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Tourerfogey
raistlin wrote:I really do think that the informality and immediacy of the internet has, at least in part, caused the downfall of basic good manners.

I was having a good rummage around earlier today on a forum I only occasionally visit and was disgusted with the number of questions, demands for information, demands for assistance etc. which all shared the commonality of not having the word PLEASE anywhere in the posts.

When I were a lad, if the word was absent when I asked either of my parents for something, I was simply ignored. It didn't take long for me to realise my error but invariably, an apology was required before I made progress by using the magic word.

Needless to say, I don't react to any of that sort of post. Unfortunately, a lot of people do, thereby perpetuating the assumption that it is acceptable to demand rather than ask.

I wonder whether the phrase THANK YOU ever crosses the minds of the demanding.




POT. KETTLE. BLACK.



any-professional-photographers-t6761.html

:roll: :lol: :clap: :-|

Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:22 #10 

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Duncan
Tourerfogey wrote:
raistlin wrote:I really do think that the informality and immediacy of the internet has, at least in part, caused the downfall of basic good manners.

I was having a good rummage around earlier today on a forum I only occasionally visit and was disgusted with the number of questions, demands for information, demands for assistance etc. which all shared the commonality of not having the word PLEASE anywhere in the posts.

When I were a lad, if the word was absent when I asked either of my parents for something, I was simply ignored. It didn't take long for me to realise my error but invariably, an apology was required before I made progress by using the magic word.

Needless to say, I don't react to any of that sort of post. Unfortunately, a lot of people do, thereby perpetuating the assumption that it is acceptable to demand rather than ask.

I wonder whether the phrase THANK YOU ever crosses the minds of the demanding.




POT. KETTLE. BLACK.



any-professional-photographers-t6761.html

:roll: :lol: :clap: :-|

Confused.com
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Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:25 #11 

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Tourerfogey
Duncan wrote:
Tourerfogey wrote:
raistlin wrote:I really do think that the informality and immediacy of the internet has, at least in part, caused the downfall of basic good manners.

I was having a good rummage around earlier today on a forum I only occasionally visit and was disgusted with the number of questions, demands for information, demands for assistance etc. which all shared the commonality of not having the word PLEASE anywhere in the posts.

When I were a lad, if the word was absent when I asked either of my parents for something, I was simply ignored. It didn't take long for me to realise my error but invariably, an apology was required before I made progress by using the magic word.

Needless to say, I don't react to any of that sort of post. Unfortunately, a lot of people do, thereby perpetuating the assumption that it is acceptable to demand rather than ask.

I wonder whether the phrase THANK YOU ever crosses the minds of the demanding.




POT. KETTLE. BLACK.



any-professional-photographers-t6761.html

:roll: :lol: :clap: :-|

Confused.com


Not difficult. Just pointing out that Paul himself is guilty of not having the manners to say 'thank you'.

Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:29 #12 

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Duncan
God, you are an arse, aren't you?
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Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:37 #13 

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Tourerfogey
Duncan wrote:God, you are an arse, aren't you?


Yet another example of 'good' manners.

Posted 02 Mar 2013, 22:39 #14 

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Jürgen
Tourerfogey wrote:Not difficult. Just pointing out that Paul himself is guilty of not having the manners to say 'thank you'.

Sorry, but I can't see what you're referring to?
Jürgen

75ZT Community & Midlands Nano Meets & 75 & ZT Enthusiasts

Posted 02 Mar 2013, 23:20 #15 


Jumper
I’ve always just assumed it was less than good manners to point out bad manners - a blank stare usually gets the message across. Come to think of it, that’s the problem with forums and some of its users.

On the parental thing I have mixed feelings. I’m sure it was not intended, but my parents seemed entirely indifferent to me in this respect. My maternal grandmother was a bigger influence on me, right from a nipper. She was typically hard-working working class, never any privileges or advantages in those ’good old days’ and was the essence of Victorian values insofar as manners, courtesy, and respect went. She was in fact, Victorian. Her legacy remains my guiding light.

Posted 02 Mar 2013, 23:42 #16 

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Bermudan 75
Duncan wrote:It wasn't the Cat perhaps was it?


No, Duncan,it was the Crown in Nantwich, frequented by many 'professional' people. A few weeks before I was in a pub near Manchester City's ground frequented by local 'working class' people, they were friendly and polite. Don't know what it is about Nantwich, but the people here are some of the worst I have come across. Her indoors who has lived here for 20 years wants to move back to her native Yorkshire and says she has found the people in this area to be very rude and pompous.

For those of you who do not know Cheshire, it is a largely rural county and is considered to be the 'stockbroker belt' of Manchester and Liverpool.
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Posted 03 Mar 2013, 00:07 #17 

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Duncan
I've stayed at the Crown a few times. Strange place that thinks it's much better than it is. Maybe some of the customers think the same way?
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Posted 03 Mar 2013, 10:16 #18 


podge
Hi chaps,it has been awhile since I last visited.Ref this thread,it seems manners are perhaps an endangered species these days.Thats not meant as a reflection on everybody but good manners,correct grammar,particulary the written word (don't even mention "texting"!)seems to be in decline now.I work with many new apprentices now ( there is a real endangered species),virtually all of them are quite respectful and many are from overseas. Our senior managment insist on using these trendy American " buz words/phrases",the latest being......."we need to dig up the drains" on this issue!
I have yet to dig up any drains on a 747!Just my two penny worth and nice to "drop in" again.P.

Posted 05 Mar 2013, 22:36 #19 

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Gate Keeper
raistlin wrote:I really do think that the informality and immediacy of the internet has, at least in part, caused the downfall of basic good manners.

I was having a good rummage around earlier today on a forum I only occasionally visit and was disgusted with the number of questions, demands for information, demands for assistance etc. which all shared the commonality of not having the word PLEASE anywhere in the posts.

When I were a lad, if the word was absent when I asked either of my parents for something, I was simply ignored. It didn't take long for me to realise my error but invariably, an apology was required before I made progress by using the magic word.

Needless to say, I don't react to any of that sort of post. Unfortunately, a lot of people do, thereby perpetuating the assumption that it is acceptable to demand rather than ask.

I wonder whether the phrase THANK YOU ever crosses the minds of the demanding.


I do not have a problem in being reminded the common courtesies which you have been writing about. Should I address you as Raistlin or Paul, given we have never met? Getting back to your statement. I remember when I were a lad, we always had to say please and thank you, no swearing was permitted and only once did I test this with my Dad at the age of 15. I used the F word and it was the last time I ever used it in the house. I have been to some of the meets down south and the F word is mentioned in certain quarters in every other sentence. I am not here to judge, as there are others who will do that. I have not tested the swear filter but I guess it will kick in should I try. The lack of manners which you have described had the profound effect of leaving you feeling disgusted after you been to a forum. If someone forgets to write please or thank you I am not disgusted, but then I am not squeaky clean either.

In light of your comments and experiences, what is your take on this forum in terms of the title of your post? I have a few other angles about this issue but for now I have said enough.
Thanks for listening.

Posted 06 Mar 2013, 12:29 #20 


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